Thursday, January 03, 2008

Italy: The Saddest Country?

Happy New Year, cara amici miei! Happy, that is, unless you live in Italy, in which case it will be a very unhappy new year, at least according to some people. I recently read a story in the New York Times about the national mood in Italy these days, which, according to the article, is not so rosy. My friends, I once promised that I would give you all views of Italy, unlike Hollywood’s cheeseball-romantic portrayals of that country in their crummy PG-13 movies. Therefore, I present to you this article, for your thoughtful consideration. As always, I cherish your thoughts and feedback.

(Note: This article originally appeared on the New York Times website; if you would like to read it there, click here.)

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In a Funk, Italy Sings an Aria of Disappointment

By IAN FISHER
Published: December 13, 2007

ROME — All the world loves Italy because it is old but still glamorous. Because it eats and drinks well but is rarely fat or drunk. Because it is the place in a hyper-regulated Europe where people still debate with perfect intelligence what, really, the red in a stoplight might mean.

But these days, for all the outside adoration and all of its innate strengths, Italy seems not to love itself. The word here is “malessere,” or “malaise”; it implies a collective funk — economic, political and social — summed up in a recent poll: Italians, despite their claim to have mastered the art of living, say they are the least happy people in Western Europe.

“It’s a country that has lost a little of its will for the future,” said Walter Veltroni, the mayor of Rome and a possible future center-left prime minister. “There is more fear than hope.”

The problems are, for the most part, not new — and that is the problem. They have simply caught up to Italy over many years, and no one seems clear on how change can come — or if it is possible anymore at all.

Italy has charted its own way of belonging to Europe, struggling as few other countries do with fractured politics, uneven growth, organized crime and a tenuous sense of nationhood. But frustration is rising that these old weaknesses are still no better, and in some cases they are worse, as the world outside outpaces the country. In 1987, Italy celebrated its economic parity with Britain. Now Spain, which joined the European Union only a year earlier, may soon overtake it, and Italy has fallen behind Britain.

Italy’s low-tech way of life may enthrall tourists, but Internet use and commerce here are among the lowest in Europe, as are wages, foreign investment and growth. Pensions, public debt and the cost of government are among the highest. The latest numbers show a nation older and poorer — to the point that Italy’s top bishop has proposed a major expansion of food packages for the poor.

Worse, worry is growing that Italy’s strengths are degrading into weaknesses. Small and medium-size businesses, long the nation’s family-run backbone, are struggling in a globalized economy, particularly with low-wage competition from China.

Doubt clouds the family itself: 70 percent of Italians between 20 and 30 still live at home, condemning the young to an extended and underproductive adolescence. Many of the brightest, like the poorest a century ago, leave Italy. The stakes have risen so high that Ronald P. Spogli, the American ambassador and someone with 40 years of experience with Italy, warns that it risks a diminished international role and relationship with Washington. America’s best friends, he notes, are its business partners — and Italy, comparatively, is not high among them. Bureaucracy and unclear rules kept United States investment in Italy in 2004 to $16.9 billion. The figure for Spain was $49.3 billion.

“They need to sever the ivy that has grown up around this fantastic 2,500-year-old tree that is threatening to kill the tree,” Mr. Spogli said.

But interviews with possible prime ministers, businesspeople, academics, economists and other Italians suggest that the largest reason for this malaise seems to be the feeling that there is little hope that the ivy can be cut, and that is making Italians both sad and angry.

An Angry Message

“Basta! Basta! Basta!” Beppe Grillo, a 59-year-old comic and blogger with swooping gray hair, howled in an interview. The word means “enough,” and he repeated it to make his point to Italy’s political class clear. In recent months, Mr. Grillo has become the defining personification of Italy’s foul mood. On Sept. 8, he gave that mood a loud voice when he called for a day of rage, to scream across Piazza Maggiore in Bologna an obscenity politely translated as “Take a hike!” A few thousand people were expected. But 50,000 jammed into the piazza, and 250,000 signed a petition for changes like term limits and the direct election of lawmakers. (Voters now cast their ballots for parties, which then choose who serves in Parliament, without the voters’ consent.)

His message was enough inaction and excess (Italian lawmakers are the best paid in Europe, driven around by the Continent’s largest fleet of chauffeured cars), enough convicted criminals in Parliament (there are 24), enough of the same, tired old faces.
“The whole kettle of fish stinks to high heaven!” he yelled. “The stench rises from the sewers and swirls around and you can’t cope.”

Mr. Grillo leans to the political left, but he spares neither side in his sold-out shows and popular blog. The problem, he said, is the system itself.

There is a link between the nation’s errant political system and its worsening mood. Luisa Corrado, an Italian economist, led the research behind the study at the University of Cambridge that found Italians to be the least happy of 15 Western European nations. The researchers linked differences in reported happiness across countries with several socio-demographic and political factors, including trust in the world around them, not least in government.

In Denmark, the happiest nation, 64 percent trusted their Parliament. For Italians, the number was 36 percent. “Unfortunately we found this issue of social trust was a bit missing” in Italy, Ms. Corrado said.

Two popular books that set off months of debate capture the distrust of large powers that cannot be controlled. One, “The Caste,” sold a million copies (in a nation where sales of 20,000 make a best seller) by exposing the sins of Italy’s political class and how it became privileged and unaccountable. Even the presidency, once above the fray, was not spared; the book put the office’s annual cost at $328 million, four times as much as Buckingham Palace.

The other book, “Gomorrah,” which sold 750,000 copies, concerns the mob around Naples, the camorra. But politics, it argues, allows the camorra to flourish, keeping Italy’s lagging south poor, and organized crime, by a recent study, the economy’s largest sector.

These are Italy’s age-old problems, but Alexander Stille, a Columbia University professor and an expert on Italy, argues that this moment is different. While the economy expanded, from the 1950s to the 1990s, Italians would tolerate bad behavior from their leaders.

But growth has been slow for years, and the quality of life is declining. Statistics now show that 11 percent of Italian families live under the poverty line, and that 15 percent have trouble spreading their salary over the month.

“The level of anger is great because before you could slough it off,” Mr. Stille said. “Now life is harder.”

Italians rarely associate the current crop of aging leaders with a capacity to change. They are the same people who have traded terms in power for more than a decade. Last year, Silvio Berlusconi, Italy’s richest man who became prime minister for the first time in 1994, was voted out for not keeping his promises for American-style growth and opportunities based on merit. When he left office, economic growth was at zero. But it became clear that getting rid of the center-right Mr. Berlusconi would be no magic cure.

Romano Prodi, who had served as prime minister from 1996 to 1998, won, but he was saddled with a shaky coalition of nine warring parties. He promised a clean slate, but his unwieldy center-left government disappointed with its first symbolic act: it appointed 102 cabinet and deputy ministers. He has pushed through two reform packages, and the economy is growing again. “Ours is not a happy situation, but it is better than before,” he said.

But the government has fallen once and threatens to fall again at every difficult vote. Small proposals bring protesters to the streets, one hurdle to making changes as protected interests seek to preserve themselves. Pharmacists shut their doors this year when the government threatened to allow supermarkets to sell aspirin. The cost for just 20 aspirin tablets at a pharmacy is $5.75.

The measure passed, but the government is largely paralyzed. Voters are fed up, and Mr. Prodi’s foes know it. “I understand the bad humor, the malaise,” said Gianfranco Fini, leader of National Alliance, the second-largest opposition party. “People are starting to get strongly angry because you have a government that doesn’t do anything.”

The Generational Divide

“It’s a sadness that what could be isn’t — that we are not a normal country,” said Gianluca Gamboni, 36, a financial adviser in Rome, summing up how he feels about Italy, which he loves, but which drives him insane. Unlike the older generation, he travels and sees how much better things work elsewhere. He does not spare himself: he still lives with his parents, not because he wants to, but because only now, after seven years at his job, can he afford Rome’s high rents. He is finally considering a place of his own.

Mr. Gamboni is on the younger side of Italy’s generational divide — a lens through which many of the country’s problems come into focus. It is one of several subterranean forces, easy to overlook at first, but that taken together make clear how much Italy has changed over the past several decades and how little that change has been digested.

Over a century, ending in the 1970s, 25 million Italians left for better lives elsewhere. Now, Italy is home to 3.7 million immigrants. The Roman Catholic Church’s position is diminishing, from a cultural pillar to a lobbying group.

Politically, Italy seems not to have adjusted to the death, in 1992, of the Christian Democrats, who governed for more than 40 years. Economically, it was once easy to solve problems by devaluing the currency, the lira. That is now impossible with the euro, which has also increased prices, particularly for housing.

Then there is the family. The divorce rate has risen. Large families are a thing of the past. Italy has one of Europe’s lowest birth rates, the fewest children under 15 and the greatest number of people over 85, apart from Sweden. Unemployment is low, at 6 percent. But 21 percent of the population between 15 and 24 did not work in 2006. And the old are not letting go.

Evidence of Italy’s age is everywhere. In parks, clutches of old ladies coo at a single toddler. On television, stars are craggy. (The median age for the presenters of this year’s Miss Italia contest was 70. The winner, Silvia Battisti, was 18.) In the political sphere, Mr. Prodi is 68, Mr. Berlusconi 71.

“The generational problem is the Italian problem,” said Mario Adinolfi, 36, a blogger and an aspiring lawmaker. “In every country young people hope. Here in Italy there is no hope anymore. Your mom keeps you home nice and softly, and you stay there and you don’t fight. And if you don’t fight, it is impossible to take power from anybody.”

“We don’t have a Google,” he added. “We can’t imagine in Italy that a 30-year-old opens a business in a garage.”

Selling a Notion of Italy

In September, word spread through a house of young Romans, over beer and pasta, that Luciano Pavarotti, the tenor and arguably the world’s most famous Italian, had died. “Damn it!” yelled Federico Boden, 28, a student. “Now all we have is pasta and pizza!”

Italy does not seem to rank as it once did for greatness. There is no new Fellini, Rossellini or Loren. Its cinema, television, art, literature and music are rarely considered on the cutting edge. But it does have Ferrari, Ducati, Vespa, Armani, Gucci, Piano, Illy, Barolo — all symbols of style and prestige. What Italy has is itself, and many believe that the future rests in trademarking mystique into “Made in Italy.”

Italian wine was an early test. Producers moved with success from quantity swill to quality. Illy, the coffee house, has flourished by combining quality and uniformity with innovation in methods and style in presentation. “This is where Italians are winners,” said Andrea Illy, the company’s president. “Use your particular strengths, which are beauty and culture.”

But Italian industry depended on low wages, making it vulnerable to competition from China as labor costs rose. Alarms began ringing years ago, with fears that many of Italy’s traditional businesses — textiles, shoes, clothes — could not compete. Many could not. In Friuli-Venezia Giulia, a chair-making capital, the number of chair companies has shrunk to about 800 from 1,200.

“At first they thought this phase would just pass,” said Massimo Martino, director of Maxdesign, a furniture company. “But in reality, many businesses ended up closing because fundamentally the market didn’t need them anymore. They didn’t want to change.”

Some companies took up the challenge. Wood was the primary material there, but Mr. Martino began to create chairs, mostly of molded plastic, well designed but inexpensive. Others decided that competing against China on price was impossible. Instead, the aim would be quality and Italy’s uniqueness, something China could not match. Pietro Costantini, who runs a third-generation furniture company, said he began focusing not just on the upper end — he makes extra-large furniture for big Americans — but also on creating lines that would sell the Italian lifestyle itself. Customers are returning.

But entrepreneurs complain that they are alone. Politicians offered little help making Italy competitive, and this remains a major impediment to making their gains grow. Businesses want less bureaucracy, more flexible labor laws and large investments in infrastructure to make moving goods around easier.

“Now it’s time to change,” said Luca Cordero di Montezemolo, the chairman of Fiat and the president of Ferrari and the influential business group Confindustria. “If not, why are we going down in every classification of competition in the country? The reason is that in the best of cases we are stopped.”

It is not clear that this “Made in Italy” strategy will be enough. Skeptics argue that foreign investment, research and development funds and money invested by venture capitalists remain too low, as does Italy’s competitiveness.
But the nation’s entrepreneurs are a bright spot in a landscape with few others. Some argue that the younger generation is another key, if not now then when those in power die. They are educated, they are well traveled and, as Beppe Grillo does when he is attracting his masses, they use the Internet.

Two center-left parties merged to produce the Democratic Party, aimed at overcoming the system’s crippling fragmentation. All sides finally agreed that a new electoral law must be redone to give more breathing room to the winner of the next elections — crucial for pushing through any major changes.

But understanding the problems is the smallest step. Many worry in the meantime that Italy may share the same fate as the Republic of Venice, based in what many say is the most beautiful of cities, but whose domination of trade with the Near East died with no culminating event. Napoleon’s conquest in 1797 only made it official. Now it is essentially an exquisite corpse, trampled over by millions of tourists. If Italy does not shed its comforts for change, many say, a similar fate awaits it: blocked by past greatness, with aging tourists the questionable source of life, the Florida of Europe.

“The malaise is: ‘I can see all that, but there is nothing I can do to change it,’” said Beppe Severgnini, a columnist for Corriere della Sera. But, he said, “to change your ways means changing your individual ways: refusing certain compromises, to start paying your taxes, don’t ask for favors when you are looking for a job, not to cheat when your child is trying to reach admission to university.”

“That’s the tricky part,” he said. “We have reached a point where hoping for some kind of white knight coming in saying, ‘We’ll sort you out,’ is over.”

“We Italians have our destiny in our hands more than ever before,” he said.

10 comments:

CoachZ said...

Yo Aaron!

I only understood a few things in this article so here are my comments:

People still living with mom and dad into their mid 30's? That's weird.

Made in Italy is going to save them? Really? How many people can afford anything made in Italy? I can't...

It seems interesting that the country started going downhill when they killed the Christian Democratic party.

I feel sorry for the country now...hopefully they can turn it around and make a comeback!

Aaron Abitia said...

Thanks P.Z. for your comments! I can speak to one of your thoughts. In Italy, I believe it is common for young men/women to remain at home up to, and even past, their 30s. (Obviously, this would be unmarried men and women.) It is a culturally accepted thing. Europeaners have less of the "independent" thing that we have here in America. In the context of this article and the 36 year old man living with his parents, I believe the point was that even though he decided it was time for him to live on his own, he just couldn't afford it. But yes, it is very different from America where when you hit 18, you're itching to get out.

CoachZ said...

yeah i was also referring to this "70 percent of Italians between 20 and 30 still live at home, condemning the young to an extended and underproductive adolescence."

I actually don't think this is too far from Americans where even though many leave the home at 18 many are still dependent on their parents well into their 30's.

I did a little thing on the kingdombuilders blog on boyhood, adolescence, and adulthood.

Anyhoo as far as Italy is concerned that is a problem when a professional at 36 who can travel around can't afford rent. Hopefully they produce something more available to everyone rather than exclusively for the rich.

ie stylish electric Vespa's that every Amurican would want because it's made in Italy AND saves us three trips a week to the gas station at $60 a pop!

I think that would solve all their problemos!

dario said...

Happy new year you too, dear the friend my. ;-)
Sorry, but i couldn't resist to put on purpose some errors eheheh.....
- Aehm... Sorry... i am not supposed to laugh... i am a sad italian! -

Okay, let me change my clothings........ There you go! i am the Italian teacher, now.

In Italian, a noun can be masculine (as for example tavolo = table) or feminine (as in casa = house, home). There is no apparent reason for this difference (the gender come from the Latin language, and it has its logic, but i am the Italian teacher, not the Latin one). Infact it's not that a table is more "macho" than a house, or that a house is a thing for blondy girls or gay people. It's just the way it is. And it's not because of some similitudes to typical masculine or feminine things, just as an example i would quote the vulgar word minchia, which is feminine, though it literally means dick, prick, or the anatomic word clitoride which is masculine, "clitoris" (i hope nobody is going to be offended by my rude language here). Okay, i make another example avoiding sex: guardia is feminine even when referred to a man guardian, and soprano is masculine although all the opera singers with that voice are women, as far as i know.
Anyway, for some type of nouns there is the masculin and the feminine versions, they are nouns referred to people or animals that can be male or female. For example dottore (masculine) is a male doctor, dottoressa (feminine) is a female doctor. That's not said that in all the cases it happens like that, as in the previous example guardia is feminine anyway, if the guardian is a man or a woman. To make an example with animals we have cane and cagna (=male and female dog), gatto and gatta (= cat), but we have giraffa (always feminine although we are speaking about a male giraf), or coccodrillo (always masculine also for female crocodiles).
In particular, for the word amico (= male friend) we have also the feminine version (amica).
In english a noun can be singular or plural, and in most of cases to transform the number it's very easy: it's enough to add or to delete a final "s", so that we have one car, but
if we were richer we would have two cars (there are exceptions, for example man, men; wife, wives, but the general rule is easy). In Italian it's not easy, because the number of exceptions from the general rule (which is: masculine nouns ending in -o have the plural ending in -i and feminine nouns in -a would be in -e in the plural) is very high, for example, while the word for "apple", mela, feminine singular becomes mele in the plural, following the rule, the feminine tigre (= tiger) in the plural is tigri.
There are also weird nouns for which the singular is masculine and the plural is feminine, as for example osso (= bone) masculine singular, in the plural is ossa, feminine.

As we said above, some nouns have the masculine and feminine version, to match the gender of the person/animal they are referred to. Obviously they can be singular and plural, to match the number too, but in this there can be a confusion: in the singular we can have one male friend, and he is an "amico", and if the friend is a female, she is an "amica". If there are two men friend, they are "amici", two women are "amiche", but if there is one man and one woman?
Well, in those cases, Italian language is a bit sciovinist, and it privileges the masculin. A group of 100 friends, 99 women and 1 man, are 100 amici (masculine plural). Note that this happens only for nouns that have the masculine and the feminine version, because a group of 100 geese, independently by the gender, would be 100 oche (feminine).

One could ask why the hell should one learn what is feminine and what is masculine. Because there is another rule, which is that the articles and the adjectives must agree with the noun they are referred to. Which takes us to the conclusion that there are four version for articles and adjectives: singular masculine, singular feminine, plural masculine and plural feminine.
Infact the determinative singular masculine article is il, lo or l' according to the first two letters of the following word, i or gli for the plural. Feminine: la or l' for the singular, le for the plural.
Please note that the article (or the adjective) do not agree with the vowel that ends the noun it is referred to, but only to the gendre and the number, so that, if you have la mela, le mele, you will also have la tigre, le tigri, because tigre - tigri is feminine, despite the end -e and -i.
Same thing for the adjective: beautiful, handsome, for example, in italian is bello (m. s.), bella (f. s.), belli (m. p.), belle (f. p.).

At the end we would say that "100 handsome guardians" would be "100 belle guardie", because the gendre and the number must match.
In the same way, if i am speaking to some dear girl-friends of mine i would say "care amiche mie" (since "amiche" is feminine plural, also the adjectives "caro" and "mio" must be put in feminine plural). If those friends are all males or some males and some females, i would say "cari amici miei" (masculine plural).

"Cara amici miei" is wrong, because the adjective "cara" doesn't match with the noun "amici" in the number nor in the gendre.

Ha! I love people that try to learn something of ours (Italians), not because we are better or something, but because we have our own culture, that is worth to be learnt because it actually is a culture, and who tries to learn it, is somebody that appreciate cultures. Bravo!

Instead i hate when somebody like that "journalist" (?) Ian Fisher, judges us just for the taste of judging who is different. I find it a tad xenophobic, or even racist.
Reading the article, I also find that he didn't understand a big lot of us, and wrote just a collection of bullshits. I read some place that The New York Times Company also produces toilet paper. Ha!

I am sorry, this is very long (i hope it will fit the limits), and i also wanted to say something also about the content. Too bad, maybe i'll do it in one of the next comments.

Anyway, if you visit this post at my blog, there is a discussion about the same article. What a coincidence eh?

Ciao, caro amico.
dario

dario said...

I would speak in this comment about that fact of the "mammoni" (that's how some Italians funnily describe the male over-30 that live with the parents).

First of all I have to say that I actually was a mammone, because i lived with my folks till the age of 32, and, although i admit i would have liked to go to live by myself, and i had to repress that desire for some reasons, including money, i don't find any shame in the condition of living with the parents also at that age.
I think it is a problem of customs of a people. For example, i don't personally know a number of Americans enough big to make a serious statistic, but some of the ones i know went to live by theirselves (or with the girlfriend/wife) even if they couldn't afford, and they wouldn't be able to do such a thing if they didn't have the support of the money from their parents (or their girlfriends'/wives' ones). Ha! Isn't this attitude to be considered as "mammoni" too?!?!?????? Duh! They are American, not such a Maccheroni People, they deserve more respect, please!

So, if the problem is money, why the hell shouldn't it be done also in Italy? I mean, if i really wanted to go to live by myself, why didn't i just ask my folks the money to rent or buy an apartment? An this is another custom of Italian culture: i wouldn't ever ask my folks any money for such a thing. My pride would induce me to have enough money from my own sweat before build an own life. American consumerism teaches the same taught, isn't it? You are nothing if you don't have money, so why should you deserve an own life?

The House, in Italy is considered something like a goal in life (not just a place to stay... a temporary solution is a little studio for rent, or a hotel, or a room at parents' house), and that's why usually.... mmmmh.... ooops.... i should say ALWAYS, houses in Italy are not just bungalow made out of wood and nails as it is in America. They are built in bricks and cement (also due for some laws to prevent fires, but not only). Because the house, in Italy, is the place where your life, your memories, your family is. It's not just a place where one go to sleep when he's tired. That's why we accept the fact that a house is expensive. Because we accept to pay a higher price for a higher value. So, when somebody builds (or buys, or anyway decides to live in) a house, he would do it in the best way so that it matches his and his family's life. In the house of my parents, for example, there is enough space for me, my brother and the respective wives/children, although i live with my wife in another house and my brother with his wife and the two girlies in a third one.
That's why, if there is no necessity, there is really no need to go to live some other place. And in this way one saves money and everybody in their family can help each other.

Actually, by culture, the enlarged family was part of the Italian social organization, till just last generation. So, being part of the culture, it is natural to have the same attitude today too.
I mean, my grandparents' family, for example, they lived in a huge house divided in tons of rooms, where the great-grandparents were the leader of the community, and everybody used to share the effort and the fruit of work, each one with their possibilities. That kind of organization was useful in agricultural societies, where the men used to do the hard work in the field, the women used to work for the maintainance of the house, the children and the husbands, and there were tasks for the kids too. In the area where my ancestors lived the production of silk was a diffuse side-business, and the job of children was to collect the leaves of mulberry to feed the silk worms. Other children works were for example to take care of the animals, or to collect the chestnuts (poor people's bread).
In that type of society there was no need to go to live by oneself. Instead, there was the need to stay all together. The only time when somebody used to go out to the family was when he (or she) decided to get married with somebody belonging to another family, in which case he (or she) used to go to live to the other family's house (or vice-versa).
Hence the custom that sill is very common, to split from the family only when one gets married.

Frankly, even though i am not sure because i don't know such a big number of Americans, i think that also in America it is pretty much the same. People use to go away when they get married. And this is also another difference from Italian style.
In italy we still use to believe that a marriage is for life. Not that the divorce is a taboo. Nowadays also divorced people are common and there is no emargination for such a choice (as it was in previous generations). But still, when somebody decides to get married, his/her intention is to try to overcome all the difficulties in order to ensure the stability of the family, especially when they have children, because we still believe in the all fascioned idea that a child should have a father and a mother. The numbers of divorces and atypical families in America proove that over there the attitudes are different. I know only few americans over 20 that are have never been married, but I know even less americans that have never been divorced atleast once. I have a girlfriend? Well, i get married. If it goes, it goes, if not... too bad, so sad, atleast we tried. No, in Italy it is not like that. Usually people decide to get married only when they are ready to share all their life with the person they are going to get married. That's why there's not a big lot of people that get married at 20 as it happens in America. It's not uncommon that couples live engaged for years and years before deciding to get married, and usually they get married because they decide it's time to live together, which means to go out from their families. It's not like "Hey dad, hey mom... we went to Vegas yesterday, this is our new address, bye bye...."

Another reason is that an always increasing number of people, in Italy, tend to study till late in the age, to reach the goal of an university degree. Because culture is considered an important thing, differently from other societies. And Universities, in Italy, are not just funny jokes as it is in lot of cases in America. In Italy, for example, there is no university degree for housewives, as there is in America. Or for singing or nailing with hammers or such a thing like that. In Italy we are more predisposed to study geology, mathematics, informatics, engineering, literature, philosphy... and all of these branches do not give only a specific knowledge, but a general culture too. It's not uncommon to reach the goal of the graduation at 28 years old as it happened to me (although i admit that i was late) in Informatics (note that it's not just computer science, but it includes also a very high level of mathematics and phisics, for example, such high that i have the qualifications to teach those matters in the high schools).
Before the graduation in such a hard universities, as you can imagine, one spends most of his life on the books, and he/she can have a just little part-time job, that hardly allows him/her just to pay his own support and maybe the cost of the university itself (which still it's cheap, compared to those American Colleges for Housewives, since in Italy Universities are supported by the state... you know, we believe important to offer education to poor people too!).
Anyway, it's obvious that, if somebody cannot afford to save any penny before the age of 28, he/she's gonna be a good software engineer (as i am), but he/she's gonna be dependant on the parents for a while.

To conclude this comment, i am not justifying anything, but i wouldn't dislike to show everybody that Ian Fisher is an idiot, because i wouldn't dare to judge an entire people just because of some facts without interpreting them in the context of the culture of that people.
And if i was such a racist, i probably would keep that feeling for myself, and not make money putting that set of shit on a popular newspaper that in some ways represent America.

I'm not finished, yet. I'll probably continue on the next comment

Ciao, ragazzi!
dario

Aaron Abitia said...

Dario!!! Thank you once again for your comments, especially that last one you posted. I read those very carefully and they are very imformative. Please keep them coming!

dario said...

Ok, that is another comment on this theme... i wonder if i will be satisfied after that ;-)

About Made in Italy.
My opinion is that the problem of our economy (the all westernians countries economies) is the distribution of resources, because:
1) Oil is finishing and new sources are not available, yet
2) New emergent economies (China and India) are ready to start to suck up the last drops of oil
3) even if there was enough oil for everybody, our markets cannot afford the attack of China and India.

That's why, to survive (i. e., to continue to expand our economies) we have to fight the attack of those "threathening enemies".

There are essencially two ways to do that.
1) to promote our products, making them more valuable than how analogous products could ever be produced in China or India
2) to fight wars so that they cannot have the oil that is necessary for them to start to fly on their own wings.

USA politics look following this last solution, that's infact why they are fighting in the middle east (and we, sheep without any balls had to follow them).
Italy instead is trying to give some characters to production that cannot be copied by anybody else in the world, infact if something has any kind of charme because it is "made in italy", it obviously would have that charme only if it is actually made in italy. No Ferrari produced in China can compete to Ferrari produced in Italy. Not because chinese people are not good enough, but because the value of a Ferrari is, first of all, the fact that it is produced in Italy.

I think that is a really clever economical weapon of Italy, because there is nothing that can compare to the culture that had been developed in Italy throughout the centuries. Nowhere in the world.

Not that i don't appreciate, for example, Maya, Aztech or other Native American cultures. The thing is that the prevalent culture in those areas are not those. Those cultures are dead. Our Italian Culture is still alive and it lives in us.
About Asian cultures, that are even older than European ones, well... their goal, to fight our culture, is to impose their own style on our market.

At the end, i wouldn't worry about the fact that Made In Italy stuffs are expensive, because that extra cost is actually what you have to pay because of the extra value of the "Made In Italy" label.

Moreover there is another thing to say. If i go out for dinner, the cheapest place i can go, in Italy, is a pizzeria. A pizza and a beer make one meal at the cost of 10 to 15 euros (7 to 11 USD). That's not a big lot for a "made in italy" best-product, is it?
The problem is that in America you are not giving money to Italy for going to Pizza Hut to eat something that you say is an "italian style" meal.
That's actually why you pay a lot for stuff labeled "made in Italy", because popular things have already been copied (if we want still continue to call "pizza" that fake shit you have in America).

99% of food stuff i buy in italian stores is produced in Italy, it is good and it is cheap.

jeremiahblackwell said...

OK DoubleA, Shelley and I are considering going to Italy for our 10 year anniversary... I'm starting to feel a little depressed about it. No.. just kidding, but I wanted to ask you for some suggestions. Unlike most Americans who visit Europe... we don't like to just blast through 20 cities and 5 countries in 3 days. We want to go and stay in one place. One city (outside of the arrival airport maybe) for 5 days or so. Where do we go? Things to consider... limited budget, traveling in August.

THANKS!

- Jeremiah

dario said...

Okay....
Aaron, you asked me ages ago in a comment on my blog where and when to go to visit, in northen Italy. Now Jeremiah is asking you suggestions about visiting Italy.

I'll try, today or in the next days, to give suggestions about it in my blog at Italian Roots.

Ciao
dario

dario said...

Aaron.
Finally i wrote a post of suggestions about where to go, when you come to visit Italy, at italianroots

Ciao
dario